[FEAT BC Admin]

In this discussion area, please feel free to share your experience in implementing A.B.A. programs in the school system. We would particularly like to hear from those parents who converted their school teams to A.B.A. We’d like to hear the nightmares as well as the success stories.

Any insight that can be shared by school-based special education assistants to help parents would also be very meaningful.

Topic

[Deleted User]

Dear Anon-EA:

If you have been a therapist for 3 years, then you should know that being a therapist for 3 years does not give you the credentials to "implement ABA in the classroom" unless it is under the direct supervision of a qualified Lovaas-ABA consultant who has decided you have the training necessary for the particular child in question.

Second, I do not have a clue what you mean by being hired to "mediate between the school board and ABA," as that phrase has no meaning. If you mean to mediate between the school board and the parents of a child under an ABA program, then again, that is something you could only do if the child's consultant approves of it.

I hope you understand you are effectively planning to practice medicine after a year of pre-med classes. You aren't ready to go solo on this one, and it can only lead to grief, your enthusiasm notwithstanding.

Please understand when I say this that I mean it with all due respect to your enthusiasm and caring nature — if you are working in my school district, you will be barred from having any contact with my child whatsoever, until such
time as my child's consultant feels you are going to be a useful and fully trained addition to her treatment team.

[Deleted User]

In response to your questions and statements,

I will respond to those of you who were solution-orientated and used conflict resolution to get information; however, I simply don't have the time or the energy to respond to those of you who did not.

I am a woman with a BA in French, Eng, and Educational Pysch from SFU. I have been an ABA therapist for almost 3 years now. I was recently hired by the school board, as I see it, to mediate between the school board and ABA as well as to implement ABA into the classroom. I have attempted to educate the principal(who by the way is moving on to the school board and I hope will advocate ABA at that level :)), and many other teachers about ABA and it's tremendous medical benifits for your children.

I will not argue with you guys. I am on your side! I absolutely agree that it should not be the school board's decision that ABA be implemented, I agree with many other comments that were made. It is ablolutely unfair the way you have been treated; unfortunatly the reality is that at this point the school boards seem to have control, is that their fault, I don't know?All I'm saying is that they are not all bad. They seem open to hearing about ABA for the most part but some may have been jaded by parents/ABA advocates that have been rude to them. I will repeat myself, I'm on your side, simply giving you some helpful advice 'cause I've experienced the school board's position. If you choose to follow it fine, if not, that's your decision. I will repeat my original email. I understand your anger, I feel it myself, but in order to help our children we may need to use some conflict resolution.

Thankyou for considering this instead of taking offence.

[Erik Minty]

Chiming in on the fray here (with apologies for the length of this post — it started out short and just kept growing). I'd first of all like to say to Avery and the other parents who posted, I think your comments are right on. Parents are the first and last line of defence and we cannot back down from what we know our children need. 18 months ago I was a skeptic, but now I am a believer: ABA is the sine qua non of autism treatment.

Also, in response to Anon.EA (seems to be your name now!) who sparked this debate: thank you for starting this debate, I've learned a few things from it. Both from your side in trying to help parents / advocates to better understand their opponents' position, and from the heartfelt, passionate responses. For the record, and perhaps I am being naive, but that is how I read the intent of the Anon.EA: not advocating the other side, just trying to explain it. Hard to tell with email sometimes, as was recently pointed out by someone.

I also echo the concerns of those who questioned the credentials and experience of someone hired to setup an ABA program, although it was unclear from the original post exactly what that job entailed. Is it setting up infrastructure to allow ABA programs to be run in-school, or is it (yikes) setting up individual programs? Sounds like a big difference to me; perhaps Anon.EA wouldn't mind clearing that up to help allay (I hope) some fears?

Mr.C will be starting Kindergarten this year, and so far everyone at the school and board have been saying all the right things … of course we will reserve judgement until we see things in action. I know he's way cooled out about going to his new school; it's great to see.

Trying to find an effective balance between optimism and skepticism. Regardless, the viewpoints will no doubt be helpful.

Erik
Mr.C's dad

[David Chan]

Dear Mr./Ms. Anon EA:

I rarely post on this board, but your statements
have so inflamed me that I cannot remain
silent.

It alarms me to no end that you think it's
perfectly reasonable for a school (who has no
medical jurisdiction whatsover) to how decide
whether a child will receive medically
necessary Lovaas-style ABA or not. Step
outside your current position and do a little
critical thinking. Autism is a highly complex
neurological disorder with an almost infinite
number of manifestations. How could
someone whose area of expertise is
operating a school make a sound decision
regarding a child with this disorder?? Would
you consult an electrician when deciding
whether your child needed neurosurgery?? It
doesn't make sense, does it?

I too am very alarmed that you bring this
incredible naivete to work with you each day
as you attempt to help this child with "the most
serious psychopathology of childhood"–aka
autism. I hope that the parents of the child in
question are comfortable with your "que sera
sera" outlook on this issue.

Please thoroughly educate yourself on the
gravely serious issue of schools failing to
meet the requirements of children with autism
before you presume to offer advice on this
board.

Julia
Mr. P's Mom

p.s. As a matter of public record, our
"kindness" died, and our son missed his
entire Grade 2 year because the
administrators of his school knew better than
we did. However, the bitter truth is that "no
school is better than bad school". He's doing
phenomenally better now, because we've
found a place where Lovaas is "allowed".

apologies if we posted twice

[David Chan]

Dear Mr./Ms. Anon EA:

I rarely post on this board, but your statements
have so inflamed me that I cannot remain
silent.

It alarms me to no end that you think it's
perfectly reasonable for a school (who has no
medical jurisdiction whatsover) to how decide
whether a child will receive medically
necessary Lovaas-style ABA or not. Step
outside your current position and do a little
critical thinking. Autism is a highly complex
neurological disorder with an almost infinite
number of manifestations. How could
someone whose area of expertise is
operating a school make a sound decision
regarding a child with this disorder?? Would
you consult an electrician when deciding
whether your child needed neurosurgery?? It
doesn't make sense, does it?

I too am very alarmed that you bring this
incredible naivete to work with you each day
as you attempt to help this child with "the most
serious psychopathology of childhood"–aka
autism. I hope that the parents of the child in
question are comfortable with your "que sera
sera" outlook on this issue.

Please thoroughly educate yourself on the
gravely serious issue of schools failing to
meet the requirements of children with autism
before you presume to offer advice on this
board.

Julia
Mr. P's Mom

p.s. As a matter of public record, our
"kindness" died, and our son missed his
entire Grade 2 year because the
administrators of his school knew better than
we did. However, the bitter truth is that "no
school is better than bad school". He's doing
phenomenally better now, because we've
found a place where Lovaas is "allowed".

[Deleted User]

Dear Anonymous (newly hired ABA EA),

I, too, bring experience from the school system – lots of it. My perspective is different than yours. With all due respect, I would like to hear your perspective a year from now when you have had a chance to live the school experience. I am a former teacher, school and district administrator and I, too, understand the district position on making decisions re: appropriate programs for our kids. I, too, know many wonderful teachers and support personnel who truly care about the children in their care and want to "make a difference" in their lives. The reality is that what they can do for our kids, under the current "system" restrictions is not enough, not informed and not effective.

As an ABA trained person, you know how very critical it is to our kids that an individual program based on their specific learning needs is put in place for them from the first day of school. You know that consistency is critical for real progress. You know that home and school programs must be completely in sync, that data must be taken and that programs must be constantly and deliberately moved ahead to keep our kids learning and being successful. You understand that the "behaviours" in ABA are about everything our kids do to learn everything they learn – language, academics, self-help, social skills, as well as maladaptive behaviours. These are complicated programs put together by skilled and experienced consultants who know our kids behaviours well and who believe they can learn. Our IEPs need to be specific, measurable, and comprehensive. Home and school programs are woven together. Separating the two is ineffective and, worse, counterproductive. Left to well-intentioned situations our kids, at best, spin their wheels and , at worst, regress.

The reality of school systems is that unions decided who will and will not work with our kids. The "resource teacher" is assigned to a school and in all likelihood knows precious little about autism and has more likely than not received training from resource programs and people who know nothing about or oppose ABA. These folks are great human beings; they just do not have the skills necessary to oversee our programs. They are not and cannot be experts in all special needs. They do not have the time needed to support our kids. We do not have the time to wait for them to get "up to speed". Those of us who have managed to get cooperation from the district in having a home-program person in school with our kids, do not use the services of the resource teachers. Our kids are on their case loads but get no service from them.

TAs/SEAs are assigned on a seniority basis, too. Are they trainable? – maybe. Do our kids have time to wait for that to happen? – absolutely not. Might they be bumped tomorrow or choose to move on for "more hours" and "less demanding programs"? – it happens all the time. Start over every year, or god forbid, many times a year? – untenable. The system is set up like that. It is my experience that TAs have often not even seen the IEPs for the students they support. Regardless of how well intentioned these folks are, they are not serving the very specific learning needs of our kids.

Parents must be the advocates for their kids. Our job as parents of children with autism is huge. We are already providing the consultant wisdom, the program, the IEP, the trained, skilled therapist and, very often, the materials. All we are asking is an inclusive attitude and environment and financial and morale support for a program that works. The courts have ruled, the gig is up and we are not going back. It is time for the system to open the doors, realize the enormous wealth of expertise, experience and passion that ABA consultants and families bring, recognize the results our programs get and do what is right.

Oh, and be polite about it? No problem.

[David Chan]

Amen,

Thanks, Avery, and Robin , et al.

Dear Anon,

We are not these people you see in school.
We never ever in our wildest dreams thought
we would become "those kind of parents" in
the school.
We are fighting for our children's lives.
We are the ones that these kids go home to
every night.
We DON'T get to go home at 3:05. It's NOT
our paying gig — It's infinitely more serious
than that.
PARENTS are the only people that have an
on-going vested interest in these children's
well being that extends beyond the beginning
of summer vacation.
Make no mistake, we will be unapologetically
passionate when it comes to OUR children .

We do what we have to. I have said this
before on this board. Our children are
dependent on the"kindness of strangers".

Why the heck should they have to be ?

Dave
Mr. P's Dad

[Louise Watson]

To the anon EA first of all we are here because of our children not to belittle anyone,your comment about ABA in the classroom , if it is not in the classroom then it is not the best possible treatment for our children this is medically necessary treatment for our children and anything less in not acceptable. As for your comment about our concerns leading to other people fighting for the rights of their children ,what is wrong with that? about your comment of us being nasty contradicts your comment above about how we dont belittle anyone, which is it?. we are fighting for our childrens lives we have a right to feel however we like. I, like the last post also think you need to learn alot before your next post.

[Jeff and Robin]

This post is directed to Ms/Mr. Anon who posted earlier this evening. I would like to recommend that you get ahold of the Auton v. The Attorney General of British Columbia and the Medical Services Commission of BC which you can download from this site. Should you also have the time it would be beneficial for you to read archived posts from parents of children with autism who have struggled to obtain medically necessary treatment for their children through "conflict resolution" and "working in good faith" with the government and various school districts only to be told that their children were low on the list of the government's funding priorities. Hundreds, albeit even thousands of parents in this province who have walked the path before FEAT days have agonized as years have ticked away as governments blatantly trod on the constitutional rights of their children. My point is this Mr./Ms Anon, "kill 'em with kindness" is an oversimplification and a very naive assumption on your part that children with autism in this province will be guaranteed an education which is their collective right. Avery, bless him, gives you the benefit of the doubt but I am not so sure. My wish for you is that you never have to experience the heartache that most of us do in fighting to ensure our children have an education which is their right under the law.
with autism.

Robin
(Jonathan's mom)

[Maureen St. Cyr]

My friends, there is an old saying which I am fond of
quoting: "The road to hell is paved with good intentions."
Well, I'm sure the post I've just read from the anonymous
EA was written with only the best of intentions.

"I'm an EA that has recently been hired by an unnamed
school board to work in their district implementing ABA
programming."

Please don't take this the wrong way, Ms. or Mr.
Anonymous, but I'd be curious to know what your
credentials are for implementing ABA programming.
Forgive me, but I have high doubts you are a bonafide
consultant, since what I have learned of them in 5
years of programming for my daughter is that they would
never advocate the behavior that you do.

"They cannot blindly cater to specialized programs like
ABA because if they did, they would be inundated with
parents advocating many other programs."

This is the argument government tries to advance as a
defence for violating the equal rights of our children under
the Canadian Constitution. It has not worked for two BC
governments, it will not work for schools or school systems
either. ABA is not a "program" which schools can choose
whether to implement — it is a judicially recognized
medical treatment which they cannot interfere with, under
pain of legal judgement. It is no different than the medical
treatment provided in the schools for other medically
fragile children, such as full-time nursing staff who are not
under the control of school or board. School personnel are
not medical experts.

"They are a governing facility; and as such, must govern
what comes in and what does not."

I'm afraid not. See my earlier comments.

"I assure you that the decision that is made, whether it is
to implement ABA or not, will be the best one for the
children based on the funding available and many other
factors that influence such a weighty decision."

No, it will not. It will be based on the child's medical
treatment needs, as determined by the child's medical
experts. Funding has nothing to do with it. As has been
decided by more than one court, no government body may
use cries of poverty to deny equal treatment. Would you be
happy, Ms./Mr. EA, if the decision whether or not to treat
the leg you break skiing was left up to whether someone
felt they could afford it? Would you like to be handed an
aspirin at VGH emergency and told, "Sorry, we just can't
afford another cast this week — perhaps if you break your
leg next year, we might be able to fit you in."

"I like the way that many people in this chat room appear
to be proactive in attempting to educate the school board
and do not seem to be belittling anyone."

It is always best to speak clearly and professionally without
personal criticism. It is truly unfortunate that we, the
parents, must educate the school boards. Unfortunate, and
ironic.

"This needs to be done so that the school boards can
make a decision as to whether or not they will implement
ABA."

Need I say again that it is not the school board's decision?

I understand you mean well, but I'm afraid you are
misguided. I hope you do not end up doing more harm
than good in your new job with the anonymous school
district. You would do best to be sure you have the
training, experience and expertise to create proper ABA
treatment programs before you attempt to do so.

Best wishes,

Avery
Ariel's Dad

[Author]

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