[FEAT BC Admin]

In this topic area, discussion is on all issues relating to setting up and running a home-based intervention program. Please feel free to bring up any problems or suggestions. Parents can help each other greatly by sharing information and giving suggestions.

In addition to parents helping parents, A.B.A. professionals on in the Discussion Group can also help provide insight and guidance.

Topic

[Maureen St. Cyr]

By the way, I see the italics don't come through in the email delivery — my last post is divided into quotes and responses. It's hard to tell which is which sometimes unless you read it on the web site.

[Maureen St. Cyr]

Stephen wrote:

At the risk of being flamed, I'd like to respond to your observations

Worry not, Stephen, flames are for usenet ;-)

If direct government funding for ABA finally comes through for BC parents, there will be a lot of demand. Where is the extra supply of professionals going to come from?

To paraphrase my mother — this is a problem I can live with. The problem is finding the money while the government keeps violating the rights of our children. Let the Lying Liberals cough up the dough, and we'll find the qualified professionals. The real problem is here severing the cozy little arrangement that sees millions of dollars shoveled off the back end of the truck into the waiting pockets of hacks who wouldn't know autism therapy if it fell from the sky and crushed them flat.

Qualified, experienced ABA professionals are fully employed wherever they are now.

Unlike the higher institutions of our beloved province, there are others around the continent that are graduating capable people every year. WEAP runs its own training program, which I alluded to in an earlier post, which graduates amazing people. When the demand goes up, the supply goes up. Yes, there may be shortfalls in the short term, but economics will rule. For the single-shingle pros like Rachel and Shelley, expansion is a difficult process, because they aren't set up for it. For well-oiled machines like WEAP/EAP, it isn't as big a hurdle. They have the systems for checks and balances and constant supervision of their people, which means they grow constantly from within, as opposed to having to attract competent others to join their team at a higher level.

(ASIDE: Please don't take these comments as me speaking for WEAP, people — these are my evaluations of my observations of them, not some official line. If you want the official line, you'll have to phone them).

Until the supply of ABA professionals catches up with demand, parents are either going to have to do without ABA treatment, or they will seek available people who are less qualified and less experienced than ideal.

Let me make this perfectly clear — you are better off delaying a program by a few months than accepting the so-called services of hacks and pretenders. You are best off methodically and diligently targeting the true professionals and gently kvetching them until you get a consultant out.

The main issue is how do parents differentiate between the ABA professionals available to them? This is a tough question. Even highly intelligent and educated parents do not innately have the tools and knowledge necessary to make an informed decision on this specific question. ABA treatment is complex, and many parents new to ABA are expected to hire the expert first, and then let the expert educate them. But how do they know if their expert really knows his or her stuff?

Okay, Stephen, I promised no flames, but please, let's retire this burnt, shriveled chestnut about parents not being capable of making an informed decision. There are a few simple, effective ways to determine which consultants are worth hiring and which aren't. First, you talk to other parents. That's one of the many things FEAT is for. You get references. You check references. You decide. You try. If the consultant isn't your cup of tea, you move on to another. You are not married to your consultant — unless of course you're one of those lucky EIBI families who are receiving the services of the Friends of MCFD Club — then you are married to them, and you should seek an immediate divorce and move on.

Board Certified Behavior Analyst and Board Certified Associate Behavior Analyst?

Better, I suppose, but again, only one piece of the puzzle. Look, you get sick, you go to the doctor, and if it's something serious, you get a second opinion. Right? Why do you do that? Because any doctor can make a mistake, and because, let's face it, some doctors are okay for treating stomach flu, but you wouldn't want to trust them with brain surgery. Well some Board Certifieds know their consulting, and some don't. My cousin was a great research doctor but he wasn't great in practice. He was mench enough to admit that to himself and he went into research and stopped seeing patients. Some Board Certifieds are great at doing the research, but not as great at the designing and running individual programs.

Years of experience using ABA with children with autism is nice too

As long as it's genuine, perhaps. As long as they were good at it, definitely. As long as they aren't lying through their teeth because some families won a court case so — oops — we better start calling our plumbers "brain surgeons" so we can keep all that nice government money rolling in. The answer to all of this is again talking to families, checking references.

How are parents new to ABA oriented and supported in their quest to establish their ABA program?

If they're lucky, they find FEAT and start talking to parents who've already been through the mill. If they're unlucky, they end up with a lot of government garbage to weed through first.

Ideally there would be an organization that would review qualifications and experience, and certify those ABA professionals that meet the requirements (similar to many other professions)

Yes, absolutely — as long as we're very careful that our beloved government doesn't populate the organization board with their untrained hogs at the trough, and as long as those same hogs don't get grandfathered into the club by virtue of their "experience." This is what happened when the Registered Clinical Counsellor group was set up — if you were a "Counsellor" before the regulations started, you became an automatic member. Some of the "Registered Clinical Counsellors" practicing in this province don't even have BACHELOR's degrees, for dog's sake. The last thing we need is for the unservice providers of B.C. to gain instant "legitimacy" by being included in the club simply because they've been nourished for decades with wasted tax dollars.

As the desk sergeant used to say on Hill Street Blues, "Hey hey! Let's be careful out there."

[Stephen Sutherland]

Dear Anonymous

At the risk of being flamed, I'd like to respond to your observations.

I think your original observation is an important one. Demand for ABA treatment has always exceeded supply of qualified, capable ABA professionals. If direct government funding for ABA finally comes through for BC parents, there will be a lot of demand. Where is the extra supply of professionals going to come from?

WEAP and others do not have an endless supply of professionals idly waiting for work. Qualified, experienced ABA professionals are fully employed wherever they are now. And it takes time to develop ABA professionals. Parents looking to hire ABA professionals today are going to find the best and brightest are already fully employed elsewhere. Until the supply of ABA professionals catches up with demand, parents are either going to have to do without ABA treatment, or they will seek available people who are less qualified and less experienced than ideal.

The main issue is how do parents differentiate between the ABA professionals available to them? This is a tough question. Even highly intelligent and educated parents do not innately have the tools and knowledge necessary to make an informed decision on this specific question. ABA treatment is complex, and many parents new to ABA are expected to hire the expert first, and then let the expert educate them. But how do they know if their expert really knows his or her stuff?

There are very few recognized standards. A Ph.D. is nice, but there are many areas within psychology. Applied Behaviour Analysis is one area, and even then, treatment of autism is but a small part of that!

Board Certified Behavior Analyst and Board Certified Associate Behavior Analyst are slowly becoming one standard qualification. Again, it is for the broad definition of ABA, not specifically autism.

Years of experience using ABA with children with autism is nice too. A large part of those years, however, should be supervised by other qualified experts to ensure experience is being gained, skills are being developed, and the person is not just collecting a paycheque.

Many needed skills are subjective, such as how a professional interacts with children, parents and others. Communication and problems solving skills are also important, but unlikely to be quantified on a resume.

I am unfamiliar with the situation in British Columbia. How are parents new to ABA oriented and supported in their quest to establish their ABA program? Is this orientation available throughout the province? Does FEAT of BC have a written definition of ABA treatment that includes recommended qualifications for consultants, senior therapists, and therapists?

Ideally there would be an organization that would review qualifications and experience, and certify those ABA professionals that meet the requirements (similar to many other professions). Such certification would be a major effort to accomplish, but would go a long way towards differentiating between Lovaas-type ABA, and other inadequate wannabes.

[Deleted User]

First, I would like to thank Mr. Raskin for his response. He has partially answered my question. I hope more is to follow, though. I think we need to set out specific qualifications that parents can use as reference when choosing people to do ABA programming with their children.

Second, I would like to respond to Mr. Chan’s comments. Although you are very energetic, I think more can be accomplished from answering questions directly than taking every opportunity to bash other less supported therapies and promote ABA. Hype may not have been the best word to use, but I was not aware my message would be judged based on my choice of words. Nonetheless, it was, and I believe the definition of “hype,” in the Oxford dictionary is as follows: “…intensive promotion of a product, etc.,” so yes, I do believe ABA fits into this category. I also think that it does not matter. The issue hear is quality service for children with Autism, not the wording of my question.

I would also like to address the issue of parent’s not being desperate enough to hire people without checking on the proper qualifications. Unfortunately, not everyone is lucky enough to be able to afford or geographically access WEAP or other highly qualified experts from the US. As a result, families ARE resorting to hiring just anyone who claims they are qualified to develop ABA programs. Next time, before you dismiss someone’s questions, I suggest that you take the time to consider that if someone is asking, there must be someone in that situation.

Without standards to define the qualifications people should have, we will, as Mr. Raskin stated, “bring more pretenders out of the woodworks.” I believe this is the purpose of this chat board, not to pick fights with other ABA supporters by picking apart the words they use in their postings. That accomplishes nothing!!!!!

[Maureen St. Cyr]

David, you kill me. You have more energy than
anyone I know, and all positive. Don't ever
stop. First, I think you meant "we won't let
JUST anyone work with our kids" – correct me
if I'm wrong. Second, I don't know if
"Anonymous" was really implying there was
an "easy" way, or looking for one even if
available. He/she is correct in thinking that all
the attention we are bringing to bear on true
science-based autism treatment is going to
bring more pretenders out of the woodwork. If
our beloved government can paper over the
same tired old nonsense and call it by a new
name and pretend it's treatment, then we
better expect the same tired old non-service
providers will be doing the same thing.

I'm too tired to speak to qualifications tonight –
and no, I'm not speaking for FEAT, just myself,
but the bottom line is David is correct in that
references are important. If a consultant can't
give you three families to phone to check on
their abilities, run the opposite way. As for the
rest, there are qualifications and then there
are qualifications. A special ed degree from
UBC does NOT make one an autism expert,
nor does it qualify one to be an autism
consultant. Sadly, there is no one at our
universities qualified to teach ABA, so the
local grads are unqualified, Q.E.D. If they go
away to one of the recognized schools and
train with the recognized experts, that's a
different story. WEAP has some very stringent
training requirements, and I think they're bang
on. Anyway, too tired for this tonight — more
later. (Hell, I'm not even FUNNY tonight).

[David Chan]

I'll tell you what hype is. Dolphin therapy, Accupunture on the tongue, that's hype. No data, and lot's of kids "Doing better" and having "dramatic change". Yup, that would be hype.

ABA sadly does not fit into that category. Know what? what people really want is a "kid" transplant, for lack of any useful effective scientific intervention. These kid have a neurological disorder, and a total kid transplant is just not forthcoming in the immediate future. ABA therapy is hard work, not hype, not magic. It works, and takes time to set up. Programs do not spring forth from the Cosmic ether, nor do consultants, or therapists. First, you examine carefully the educational credentials of the consultnat, then you get references from other families, you screen, and you WATCH every aspect of the program being implemented. EASY, I think not. EFFECTIVE, YOU BET !!

I think the operative word is YOU. We as parents bear the burden of choosing therapies that are effective for our kids. I think it's really condescending to think that parents are so desperate that we would let just anyone work with our kids. In fact, it is precisely because we WON'T let anyone work with our children that we have chosen ABA therapy.

Still living la Vida Lovaas,
Mr. P's Dad

[Deleted User]

Hi, with all of the hype right now about ABA, and the hopeful funding that is coming to the parents of children with Autism, there is bound to be an increase in the number of people offering to provide ABA. I was wondering what qualifications FEAT recommends people have, who are doing ABA with a child without the supervision of an ABA consultant, as well as the qualifications that an ABA consultant should have. My concern is that parents who are desperate to receive ABA for their children may hire professionals who are not qualified to provide that service. Setting standards that parents can refer to will hopefully help to reduce this from occurring.

[Deleted User]

Hi, with all of the hype right now about ABA, and the hopeful funding that is coming to the parents of children with Autism, there is bound to be an increase in the number of people offering to provide ABA. I was wondering what qualifications FEAT recommends people have, who are doing ABA with a child without the supervision of an ABA consultant, as well as the qualifications that an ABA consultant should have. My concern is that parents who are desperate to receive ABA for their children may hire professionals who are not qualified to provide that service. Setting standards that parents can refer to will hopefully help to reduce this from occurring.

[Diana Sabbagh]

Hi List,
I heard about the DAN treatment is a biological treatment protocol which addresses the
biological
reasons why a child might have autism.
Did anyone make this treatment for his child?? and if someone can tell me please where can I do it ????.
My e-mail is:
Di20d@yahoo.com
Thanx .
Diana ( Jenny's mom )

[Sara White]

I'm new to this whole posting thing, but I wanted to respond to the posting by David DiSanto on last Monday. I worked for two years in BC before moving to California to go to school. In the area where I was in California (not LA) there was a Lovaas replication site. While I can't speak for all of the replication sites I can say that while they had some tutors who were excellent and very well trained, they also had people who were not as good and had little training. There is a high demand for tutors and a low supply everywhere. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the individual and NOT the training is what is important. I have seen tutors in Vancouver who are superior in training and skill to Lovaas trained tutors in California. Like David said it really comes down to the ability and experience of your supervisor.

[Author]

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