[FEAT BC Admin]

This area is for discussions in general topics.

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[Deleted User]

Hello,
In response to todays passionate dicussion, re: approaches, I think there is a good basis to the writers posting. Re- direction and re-inforcement of appropriate behaviors are both effective and ethical, but as a "support person" it is both unethical and more importantly completely inappropriate to use any such "therapy" which does not convey respect and support a PERSONS dignity.

[FEAT BC Admin]

Hello everyone,

It appears as though we’re into another emotional thread.

Just a quick reminder regarding the discussion board rules from the "Welcome" page at the web site. We ask everyone to please keep these in mind when writing and proofing posts:

"1) Be courteous to each other …"

"2) Personal attacks are not permissible… We respect all opinions even if we disagree with them."

Although it is entirely understandable when certain issues evoke passionate responses, there is a key premise of a discussion board that must be honoured if an Internet forum is to work well: folks need to separate any given issue (however contentious) from the person who raised it. In other words, strong, impassioned arguments are okay when they focus on aspects of an idea or position. They can be very counterproductive if they focus on a member of this group who put forth the idea.

Healthy debate is a good thing, even where clearly difficult issues are involved. However, if discussion group rules one and two are not respected, this may jeopardize the important quality of the discussion board as a place for civilized and open exchange of ideas. People must feel comfortable and free to post divergent views.

Thank you all for your cooperation in ensuring the forum is a good place to be … and a strong community.

Isaac (Miki's Dad)
Volunteer Board Admin.

[Deleted User]

I agree with Pete Stelmaschuk. The purpose of these posts are to provide parents with information, help and support. Attaching and insulting others based on their opinions, wording and spelling, helps no one. It provides no information, and does not support anyone. It is okay to disagree with what others say, but we must maintain a level of maturity. It is possible to express disagreement and still show respect for the person who made the original statement. Please remember that we want parents to feel free to use this service, not scare them away. Not to mention, petty bickering does not reflect favorably on FEAT, or the parents bickering.

[Pete Stelmaschuk]

It is unfortunate that so many parents say such hurtful things to each other. I will not waste my time again in replying and asking for parents to consider social graces in speaking to each other on this board.

[Graham Egli]

To Andrew's parents Alex & Sasha,

Our son was diagnosed a few years ago. You are lucky first to have a diagnosis as often these are hard to obtain or come later in life. Our experience is one that requires the whole family parents and siblings to sacrifice. Time, household order and fatigue not to mention economic stress and strain all come into play. You will get tired, very tired. No question to try and help Andrew will be an enormous effort on your part. The payoff is the hope that he will be able to function in society as he grows up. Not to help him would be ensuring him a lifetime of problems and troubles. My best advice to you is to start the program ASAP try for as many hours therapy as you can get, but take as few as are available. Consultants and therapists are hard to find, keep plugging. One or both of you can also be a therapist. Be prepared for chaos around the house and your schedules. Try and make time for yourselves if possible even an hour alone will help avoid tension and burn out. Be prepared to hear Andrew cry and yell during therapy it hurts to hear but once you know and understand ABA you also understand that he really is not suffering as much as complaining. Though ABA is at times still hard to take as a parent as you always try to protect your child and changing his behaviour will upset him. Consultants and leads will drive you nuts with their ABA babbblegoop language ( I am not sure why but they don't like to talk in plain English)You will get frustrated keep trying, go on. You will gasp at the money flowing keep trying go on. Ask any one you know if they want to be junior therapists to add hours to the therapy, kids at the local Y, neighbours children, students etc. Remember always you are helping Andrew and you have to go through the years of effort to do so. Read books and articles educate yourself, join groups, hound the government (and be prepared for little assistance there)talk to people explain Andrew's problem don't hide it it is not his fault he is different. Treat him as normal as you can. Do not talk about "him" in front of him he probably hears everything and understands even if he doesn't verbalize back. Remember to give Andrew childhood things that he would normally receive, trips to park, ice cream, parties etc. He will appreciate the diversion from therapy, as therapy is work for him. Above all just keep trying and start as soon as you can every day he has help is important. Delay is not an option. You'll make it I promise.

Graham (Thor's(4 years old) Dad)

[Karen Anthony]

So Mr. Stelmaschuck doesn't think pepper on the tongue is the worst thing that could happen to a child. What an effective yet simplistic type of criteria! Actually, the reason I chose my family doctor is that I heard he's not afraid to say things like, "well yes, your arm does have a nasty break, but it's not the worst thing that could happen to you so stop complaining".

In my book, use of this type of criteria or consideration of this approach exposes a basic lack of respect for another person that should make ANY parent shudder.

Andre
(Ryan's dad)

[Pete Stelmaschuk]

Any intervention done out of anger is harmful to a child. I see an awful amount of anger coming from some messages. I have been watching the boards lately and I think we should remember that parents and therapist need to work together. Some old fashioned politeness would help. Lets cut each other some slack.

No therapist should use aversives (spelling okay?)unless parents are in agreement. Sometimes, as a last resort, aversives are the only thing that work. Pepper doesn't sound like the worst thing that can happen to a child. How about a lifetime of exclusion and dirty looks because parents allowed inappropriate behavior to continue.

Sometimes parents need to act as parents and without fear that someone may disapprove of their methods. Ultimately, parents have to live with their decisions and their course of action with their child.

[Maureen St. Cyr]

Mr. or Ms. Smith, as the case may be — this is what's known in the online world as a flame. I'm sure you are a very nice person in all sorts of ways and mean nothing but the best, but you will never work with my daughter, despite your claim to have "worked with many autistic children".

My first question for you would be what bonafide consultants have you worked under that would allow you to use aversives? And that's what they're called, by the way, not "adversives". You think a little pepper on the tongue is "very succesful"? How would you like a little pepper on YOUR tongue? Better yet, how would you like a half a bottle of Tabasco sauce on your tongue? One can only wonder at your idea of time out, but somehow from your gleeful suggestions to torture children with capsicum powder, I envision tied to a chair in the corner. Is this the Friends of Government school of ABA, perhaps?

Pay attention and hear me well. If I EVER caught a therapist doing what you suggest, I would fire them on the spot.

[Deleted User]

RE: SCREAMING

I have worked with many autistic children that seem to like this method of communication and I know it can be very testing at times :)

It really comes down to why the child is screaming and therefore, how can you prevent it from happening or re-direct the child in a more positive way of communicating (using PECS, sign language or whatever works best with the child). Like with any other inapproiate behaviour, you want to really reinforce the approiate behaviour and pay little or no attention to the inapproiate one. If he is stopping when you come into the room it sounds like he is seeking your attention and therefore ignoring it (or extinction) is usually best. It always gets worse before it gets better :)

Some things that have worked for me:

1. extinction
2. time out
3. adversive – a little pepper on the tongue (very successful)
4. reverse cost – (reverse token economy)

Good Luck!

[Deleted User]

Hello everybody!

Our two-years old son has been diagnosed with autism four month ago, just few days before his little brother was born, and since then we have been shocked and almost paralysed with fear that we will not be able to cope with arising problems. We need to set up an ABA program and we don't have any experience of this kind. We also desperately need some advice on effective advocacy.

Any information or just a word of support would be greately appreciated.

Alex and Sasha,
Andrew's parents atrb@canada.com

[Author]

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