[FEAT BC Admin]

This area is for discussions in general topics.

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[edgecombe]

Hi. Our 4 1/2 year old son Bryan was recently diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome. He will be starting kindergarten in September. Does anybody in the Langley area know what the School District has to offer in terms of Teacher's Aids?

Any infomation will be much appreciated! Thank you.

[Deleted User]

I have extensive experience teaching Instructor Therapist the principles ABA Intensive
Behaviour Intervention. for children with Autism I want to ensure you that a well executed program is designed to fade prompts and thin reinfrorcement schedules. In conjunction with taking skills taught in a direct teaching format to an activity embedded program and incidental teaching opportunities. If you need added information contact me at henpenney@yahoo.com.

FeatBC Discussion Board wrote:

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FeatBC Discussion Board: Room One: General Topics Discussion
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By Jack Malli (Malli) on Friday, July 11, 2003 – 12:56 pm:

Hi. Our 4 year old daughter Bronte has been diagnosed
Autistic Spectrum Disorder only a few weeks ago. We are
exploring all options in terms of intervention. I have heard
many promising comments about Dr. Lovaas and the ABA
approach. However, I have also heard some criticism. The
very pragmatic, skill-building approach appeals to me very
much (I am not a touchy-feely type). Yet one concern I have
is that in order for the ABA to continue to work throughout
my daughter's life, she will continually need to be
positively reinforced by a therapist or parent. My wife and
I would like to see Bronte eventually live her life as
independently as possible and to integrate learned skills
into her everyday living. That is, to become a problem
solver using her own reasoning abilities and intuition to
respond creatively to life's challenges. The criticism I
have heard is that if the Lovaas method is not applied
continually by another person, Bronte could in fact regress
and lose the skills she may have learned.
Would anyone like to comment on this? Thank you.

[Barbara Rodrigues]

Ah, let me get in on this. Applied Behavior Analysis can be worked out in our own life. As Laurie states don't we all learn by reinforcement – of course. If you went to work and didn't get paid (reinforcement) would you continue? If you did a favour for someone or you did the dishes, etc. and no one ever said, hey thanks, hon or great job would you continue to do so? Dr. Foxx has said we continue to do and try things that are reinforcing to us. . . example – I am a good water skier now- was I always no way but I was taught by some great people – who cheered me on and kept telling me I could do it when I thought I might never – but they encouraged me through their positive reinforcement and hence I continued to learn. Now water skiing is reinforcing in itself – I don't need those people to cheer me on any longer.

ABA is applied in the same way – the child learns new skills – play skills, social, academic, etc. and heavy reinforcement to begin with. As they learn and the skills become easy – reinforcement is faded or the drills/skills become the 'reinforcement' in itself (this has happened with us with certain academic drills and play skills such a biking, baseball, etc.)

A well rounded ABA program utilizes reinforcement and reinforcement fading. You also start to work on a token system (or can) for bigger rewards – a trip to the park (because now through ABA your child loves to play appropriately!) etc. You start to use itermitten(sp?) reinforcement – only reinforcing every 3-4 answer/time etc. You use this principal much like in toilet training – heavy reinforcement and tons of prompts to begin with and faded over time. You still don't get a candy for pee in the toilet 3 years later sort of thing.

Regression is a sad fact for some kids and many factors play into it and at times it is not because of lack of reinforcement but reinforcement helps correct the regressed behaviors (along with a behavior plan, etc. etc. again a consultant will tell you all this as each child is so individual).

ABA can be used to teach a child that a check mark beside their answer on the homework sheet is just the same as a loud hooray and verbal "job well done" – with the use of reinforcement and fading.

ABA is a science – it's the science of behavior and teaching – it has the data to prove it and back it and people can say all they want against it but ask them to show the data on their 'theories' and explain how they actually teach – not 'oh it just happens' and well they need this 'sensory input', yakkity , yak. ABA works – don't take my word for it – read the science – try it for 6 months – give your little girl 6 months and I a guarantee you – you will give her her best chance. That is using a actual Lovaas-style ABA consultant and therapists.

Good luck to you and your family.

Barbara

ps: There's a video available now from Different Roads to learning about this put out by Dr. Sabrina Freeman – I think it's worth a look.
I don't know if it's available here-anyone? Can't remember the name something What do I do now?

[Laurie Guerra]

I guess my first point would be, "What choice do you have?" It's not as though there is any other treatment that is even proven to work let alone not have reinforcements.

Secondly, don't we all learn by being reinforced? Would you study to be a doctor if you only made minimum wage? How about enterring into relationships if there were nothing in them to gain?

Just my thoughts………

[Deleted User]

Just to explain "fading reinforcements" a little bit more (because the term may be contentious or unfamiliar) – and anyone more educated/experienced please feel free to correct me on any point – we don't completely stop reinforcing appropriate responses.

Yes, at first we may begin with things like candy, and cool toys, or 'stimmy' objects, or tickles – whatever the child most enjoys. Over time (and this could be a short time, or it could be a long time) we try to 'fade' the reinforcement so that the child will continue to perform the tasks and responses for lesser reinforcement – and, eventually, just because it feels good inside to know you "did it right". Of course, throughout this time, we try to keep using strong reinforcement for difficult tasks, but by and large the reinforcement may look like a simple "hi 5" or a "Good job!" in a typical voice.

Particularly as children get older, this is important. The 8 year olds I work with don't much appreciate tickles (though one loves to be squeezed), but a "Wow, you did SUCH a good job!" or a "hi 5" can make that smile come out SO FAST sometimes. Meanwhile, the 3 year old I work with loves it when I yell really loudly and clap ("Yay! Hooray! You did it!), let a balloon fly around the room, or do my "tickle song" (you'd have to see it to know what I mean). None of those three types of reinforcement are appropriate for the 8 year olds, and I don't think either of them would even be interested.

It's all so dependent on the individual child, but people have to be good at figuring out what kinds of "lesser" reinforcement are going to work as you move towards the fading.

I hope this is informative, and I hope it's mostly correct!

-Janna Hoskin, ABA Therapist

[Erik Minty]

Apologies for the minor gaffe in my opening paragraph. I started editing and mistakenly assumed the "Post this message" button would discard the changes I had made below.

All I was trying to say was that there may be specific instances (I don't personally know of any) where this is not well done in practice, but in theory I believe it should be.

Cheers

[Erik Minty]

Jack –

In response to your question about skills regressing, this is a really good question. In theory I don't believe the specific criticism to which you refer is very well-founded. In practice, there are no doubt examples to be found where this is a valid concern, but . In our son's program, our team has been very adept at "fading out" prompts and naturalizing skills so that they become truly learned. Thus those skills and behavioural improvements >>in general<< have not regressed.

On the occasions where he has "regressed" (i.e., started to fall back into old patterns), this was promptly caught and re-inserted back into the program.

Others may disagree, but I have become a firm believer in (as far as it makes sense for the individual child of course) naturalizing skills and fading prompts / reinforcements when they are no longer necessary. (It almost sounds obvious when I go back and re-read it.)

I would further argue (although I am a parent and not a trained ABA consultant) from my own experience, that I believe this to be a critical component of any ABA program.

That having been said, you still need to find a good consultant and hire good therapists. I believe you'd be hard-pressed to find too many parents who have tried ABA and don't believe in it (someone prove me wrong). On the contrary, it WORKS. Of course keep exploring all options, because there will no doubt be other things that you will find beneficial to your daughter, but I don't believe the specific criticism you've heard about ABA is very well-founded.

Best of luck

[Jack & Cheryl Malli]

Hi. Our 4 year old daughter Bronte has been diagnosed Autistic Spectrum Disorder only a few weeks ago. We are exploring all options in terms of intervention. I have heard many promising comments about Dr. Lovaas and the ABA approach. However, I have also heard some criticism. The very pragmatic, skill-building approach appeals to me very much (I am not a touchy-feely type). Yet one concern I have is that in order for the ABA to continue to work throughout my daughter's life, she will continually need to be positively reinforced by a therapist or parent. My wife and I would like to see Bronte eventually live her life as independently as possible and to integrate learned skills into her everyday living. That is, to become a problem solver using her own reasoning abilities and intuition to respond creatively to life's challenges. The criticism I have heard is that if the Lovaas method is not applied continually by another person, Bronte could in fact regress and lose the skills she may have learned.
Would anyone like to comment on this? Thank you.

[Debra Antifaev]

Hi everyone,

If you have been reading the CHAT of late you will notice a lot of anonymous email from people who don't really support our Autistic children or the method of intervention we have all, as parents, chosen to give them a successful life. I have a few issues that I would like to discuss with like minded parents but I am very nervous about using the FEAT chat as a forum.
It is for this reason I am asking parents of children in "approved" Lovaas based ABA programs to contact me (Government providers need not apply)I have a 6 year old son in a very successful program with the Early Autism Project.
If you are also nervous about contacting me you can call either Jean Lewis or Sabrina Freeman to confirm that I am one of the "good" guys.
I have email or phone contact with many of you, anyone I may have missed…please contact me at 604-531-1846 or email me at dmantifaev@shaw.ca

Thanks
Debra
Ben's Mom

[Alexandra Samofalova]

Hello everyone!

Can anyone recommend a babysitter in Burnaby area, who are good with autistic children? We feel we need one occasionally, but being newcomers to Canada have no idea how to find one, so any bit of information will help. Our son is 3 1/2, he's very calm and obedient, so babysitting him is not a problem if he has something to do (a book, puzzle, toys etc).

Thank you!

Alexandra

cplnk@hotmail.com

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