[Deleted User]

I want to provide some information about Fluency Based ABA for those of you who are interested. Fluency Based Instruction, like Discrete Trial Teaching is based on the work of B.F. Skinner and his book “Verbal Behavior” which was published in 1957.
The following components are included in a Fluency based ABA program:
– Skills are established
– Skills are practiced daily
– All practices are timed
– (All) Performance is graphed on the Standard Celeration Chart
– Every three data points are assessed
– Changes are made when the student's learning does not grow
– Outcomes of Fluency (RESA) are empirically validated
A range of instructional procedures are used to establish skills such as:
– Discrete Trial Teaching
– Direct Instruction
– Errorless Learning procedures
– Discrimination Training
– Incidental Teaching
Instruction may be delivered in a variety of arrangements:
– whole class
– small group
– 1:1
– Teacher led
– Therapist led
Outcomes Data (RESA) – A skill is not considered mastered until it has passed these 4 checks
– Retention
– Endurance
– Stability
– Application
The use of ABA in treating children with autism began with Dr. Lovaas’ research 30 years ago but did not become universally known to the majority of people until Catherine Maurice published her book “Let Me Hear Your Voice” in 1993. In other words, if there had been no Ivar Lovaas there may be no research, if there had been no Catherine Maurice no one would know about it. We have both of these people to thank as well as the many hard-working researchers and practitioners in the field of ABA who are dedicating their lives to improving the lives of our children with autism. Fluency Based ABA is relatively new to the field of scientific treatment of autism but should not be dismissed as experimental and lumped together with non-scientific treatments such as Floor time, swimming with the dolphins, music therapy, etc. Although I can’t begin to express myself as intellectually or eloquently as Sabrina I know from my experience that my son’s Fluency Based ABA program has made “THE” difference in skill acquisition, mastery and generalization. Fluency is the way we take data, make data based decisions and structure teaching sessions. It can be used in conjunction with a LOVAAS program. My purpose for posting here is to demystify Fluency Based ABA for those of you who have shown an interest in this information. If we dismiss this method of ABA, which is relatively new but does have published peer reviewed data to support it, we would be making the same mistake as people who dismissed Lovaas’ work when it was relatively new 25 years ago.
I am and will always be grateful for the work of Dr. LOVAAS and the support of FEATBC when my son was diagnosed over 6 years ago. Back then, FEATBC was a very new organization and not a lot of families were doing ABA programs for their children with autism. We have all grown a great deal over the years and our similarities are greater than our differences. I’ve always believed that we have enough to do without fighting amongst ourselves.
Very respectfully,

DeeDee Doyle – with an apology to Sabrina for posting this after your request to take it somewhere else.

[Deleted User]

I've been sitting back here reading this giant pile of claptrap for the last few days now and if you all will excuse my plain speaking, I am not so well versed in all this politicking and double speak you are so good at. What I see is a group of people doing some kind of new thing or other who want to hijack this group and the work that the people in the law case have been doing for some years now. Frankly that just pisses me off. You want to sell your fluincy thing or your sensory intigration thing or any old other thing, you go right ahead and form your own group wherever you damn well like. But no, as I understand it FEAT is not about supporting the giant pie in the sky wishes of every person who comes up the pike with a new way to slice the same roast. This is supposed to be about people who are doing the scientifically proven thing supporting each other and fighting the good fight to see our children are no longer prejudiuced by these bloody fools we elect every five years or whatever. And I don't care to be reading any more messages from people splitting hairs about what the published rules of FEAT BC are. You know what, as far as I am concerned the rules are whatever Sabrina and the directors want them to be. She's steered me right so far and I'll trust her over some bunch of twits in the United States selling the latest snake oil. Hell, Ivar Lovaas isn't on that certification board list either. And neither are any of the local consultants I can see. I'm tired of this. I'm turning off my email notification so I don't have to read this bull anymore. Put that in your stopwatch and smoke it. I'd say more about what I think of you but I don't want to be breaking that rule about personal attacks.

[Deleted User]

Thanks Laurie,
you wrote; "THIS discussion forum is specific to Lovaas-ABA"

from the featbc website on chat forum;

"The FEAT BC discussion FORUM is your meeting place with other parents of children with autism, and an information resource for the behavioural autism treatment program of your child."

Seems pretty open to me. But it does the go on to say:

"The FEAT BC Discussion Group is the place to discuss ALL topics relevant to home-based Lovaas behavioural autism treatment programs (including Government funding and school issues). When we use the term Lovaas autism treatment, we mean discrete-trial-based interventions for autism and related disorders.
So…come on in and post your messages

…let your voice be heard!"

There seems to be some grey area here on what is appropriate looking at these two vision statements.

You should state then that this GROUP is for Lovaas-ABA, however the FORUM is for parents of children with Autism.

I know that my child and many others have had consultants who used Lovaas protocol and benefitted. I also know that my child and many others have programs that have advanced and grown to reflect their specific needs. Just because our current consultant doesn't follow a strict Lovaas protocol doesn't mean that our childs program isn't managed with good science and ethics.
I wasn't saying Sabrina said something that contradicts her role as director I was saying that she is saying something is an irrelevant topic when it is not and she knows it. You could say I am accusing her of duplicity to forward her own viewpoint and that would be much more accurate.

How can a Certification Board created to ensure autistic kids get science based autism treatment be irrelevant to the discussion here? After all There is a Lovaas consultant practicing within the province who has a level of board certification. I am sure she got certified to be a more competent consultant and have no doubt that the local organization she is with is also proud of her level of certification.

A very pro Lovaas individual stated on this chat forum that the government contractor(s) are certified (which NONE of them are or they would be listed as such on the certification board website) and inferred that we should discredit anyone certified as being so lacking in skill that they need certification to pass themselves off.
Is it ok for this misinformed individual to spread disinformation about certification because he is all for Lovaas ABA but others are off topic if they are instead stating truths and facts about certification?

I am just wondering if this forum is as open to discussion for parents of autistic children as it says or just to what the directors accept as helpful to their personal agendas and interests.

Laurie, The courts recognized that Applied Behavior Analysis, also called Intensive Behavioral intervention is the most effective form of science based treatment for Autistic children.
The courts refused to order any specific brand of behavioural therapy as scientific evidence does NOT show Lovaas as the only protocol with merit. That assertion however is an opinion widely forwarded on this board. For people of that opinion to forward it as an undisputable fact is misleading.

With the utmost respect for you and all other parents and your choices in treatment and views presented in this forum.

Alex Barclay

[Deleted User]

Sabrina, I will remind you in a phone conversation several weeks ago that you said to me:

" There is nothing more that I would like to see than to have all the consultants in BC be Board Certified ".

Sabrina posted Friday, September 19, 2003 – 11:05 pm: "The FEAT BC board is not the appropriate forum to discuss the fluency topic and therefore, neither is the recent thread on the importance of Board Certification."

Now I see you posting that certification is not an issue of consequence and that it is not an appropriate thread for this forum.

However there are many Board Certified consultants in Canada and the US using Lovaas protocol who are certified.

If you are only there for people using Lovaas protocol and the rest of us can go away just come out and say it loud and clear.

Alex Barclay

[Deleted User]

I was able to locate on the FEAT of Northern California web site a four page document setting out Guideline for Choosing an ABA provider. It contains direct questions that you should ask services providers before retaining their services.

http://www.php.com/sigsupplements/feat/Provider_Guidelines.pdf

Joyce Dassonville GN LLB
Family Law and Health & Disability Law

Address: # 114 – 8532 120th Street
Surrey, British Columbia,
V3W 3N5
Phone: (604) 598-8623
Fax: (604) 598-8624
Email: joyce@dassonvillelaw.ca
Web Page: http://www.dassonvillelaw.ca

[Deleted User]

I am writing this post in reply to a voice mail I received from Sabrina Freeman. (Sorry Sabrina, I did not check my messages until this morning, as I was attending to other matters yesterday.)

Sabrina indicated that FEAT had received several phone calls from parents who were somewhat confused as to what my previously posted letter to my social worker, seeking funding after the Anderson decision, really meant.

The most important element of any court action is the evidence upon which you base your requests to the court. Having the law on your side also helps! It is easier to have the law on your side than it is to change the law. Regardless of the law, you have no case at all if you have no evidence.

If you want to ask a court to order the government to do something, you must first have asked the government yourself and have been refused. Not only do you have to have a written refusal (or repeated non-replies may be sufficient in some cases), you have to be able to convince the court that you took all reasonable and possible steps to secure what you were seeking, prior to coming to court.

That means that one refusal by the lowest employee, on the chain of command is not sufficient. The courts try to stay out of government business as much as possible so you have to give them a very good reason to intervene.

Do not expect that one letter or even three or four letters to government officials will result in a cheque reimbursing you for all your expenses in paying for you ABA/IBI "medically necessary therapy" for your child. While that would be nice, I have yet to see any government make it that easy for parents. While we can always hope that the government will do the right thing, do not count on receiving any money quickly.

What the letters I am writing, and suggesting that you also write, will accomplish, is a long paper trail of requests and the resulting refusals and/or failure to reply. I will be posting all of my letters, each one higher up the chain of command, so that other parents may copy or modify them as they see fit.

Each letter that I write will go one step higher up the chain of command, creating the necessary paper trail, until there is simply no place left in government to send my request. When that point is reached and only when that point is reached, will I have a case to take to court for what is called in legal terms a "Judicial Review".

As per an anonymous post last night, it appears that Anderson has already been appealed to the BC Court of Appeal. I have been busy on other matters in the last two days and have not yet confirmed the filing of any appeal. I had been waiting until Monday to write my second letter, as I was waiting to see if an appeal would be filed before deciding exactly what to say in the next letter.

Sabrina, if you can confirm that you have received notification from your lawyers that Anderson has in fact been appealed that may be of interest to other parents. I will have no opportunity to confirm any filing of an appeal until Monday and would not be able to share that information until after I get back to my computer late Monday evening.

Whether Anderson has been appealed or not, I intend to continue to build my PAPER TRAIL, until I have sufficient evidence to commence a Judicial Review. I can continue to hope that it will not be necessary, but at the same time, I am prepared to go all the way. My daughter deserves nothing less from me.

As I had suggested in one of my first posts on this topic, I would be happy to talk to other parents who are also willing to take this matter all the way to court. It is not my intention to make a profit on the backs of other parents fighting for their children, just as I am fighting for mine, only to cover my costs.

I hope this clarifies the questions that Sabrina has been fielding. Sabrina, if you require anything further from me, just let me know and I will do the best that I can.

Joyce Dassonville GN LLB
Family Law and Health & Disability Law

Address: # 114 – 8532 120th Street
Surrey, British Columbia,
V3W 3N5
Phone: (604) 598-8623
Fax: (604) 598-8624
Email: joyce@dassonvillelaw.ca
Web Page: http://www.dassonvillelaw.ca

[Deleted User]

To E. Minty & Paperman
For info. re Fluency Based ABA you should contact Michael A Fabrizio, M.A., B.C.B.A.
1110 24th Ave. South
Seattle, WA 98144-3037

[Deleted User]

I am replying to Erik Minty.

My daughter is currently doing a Fluency Based Training ABA Program. Prior to this she had a Lovass based program for almost 3 years. A Fluency Based Training Program is an ABA program. She made tremendous progress in her Lovaas based ABA program and is making even better progress in her current Fluency Based Training ABA Program.

I am not an expert on Fluency Based Training ABA Programs, I am only a Mom of an autistic child who is making great progress. My daughter has come a long way and has a long way to go yet.

My best effort to describe a Fluency Based Training ABA Program is as follows. A properly designed Fluency Based Training ABA Program incorporates efficient, effective practice strategies that enable learners to achieve fluency, or true mastery of skills. When accuracy is combined with speed, it is called fluent performance. People exhibit fluency—the ability to think, speak, and act correctly and quickly, without hesitation and almost automatically. It is this speed and relative ease, not merely accuracy or correctness, that separates the fluent from the non-fluent.

The following guidelines also help describe fluency.

1. Provide sufficient practice opportunities. Fluency only comes with practice. Few training programs in any field (besides music or athletics) provide sufficient practice opportunities to attain fluency. It’s important that a Fluency Based Training ABA Program includes enough examples and exercises on critical skills and functions to practice to the point of fluency.
2. Build fluency in small chunks. Until one is fluent, it’s better to work in brief practice sessions than for extended, tiring periods. Likewise, it’s far easier to build fluency on a small set of commands or functions than to try to become fluent on a larger number at once. Therefore, it’s advisable to design brief repeated practice activities (one to five minutes each) with short breaks in between. Dysfluent skills create weak foundations for further learning.
3. Establish fluency goals. Because fluency is accuracy plus speed, you set time criteria for every skill.
4. Measure performance. Time brief practice activities and count.
5. Define fluency objectively, in terms of time limits plus accuracy levels. You can’t predict how long it will take a given individual to reach fluency. Invariably, some attain fluency faster than others, so individualized practice is best.

When working with a Lovaas based ABA program Dominique would sometimes need “maintenance” sessions as she would forget past learned skills over time. This is no longer a problem with the Fluency Based Training ABA Program. She now learns each individual skill to the point of fluency before building on that skill. The skill is solid and able to be used to build upon. I do not have the expertise to better explain the small differences between a Fluency Based Training ABA Program and a Lovaas based ABA program. My daughter has benefited a great deal from each of the two programs.

There are hundreds of reported peer review articles on Fluency Based Training ABA Programs, some available on the Internet. Perhaps you could have a look at a few of them if you are interested. I really cannot explain it any better. I just know how my daughter is doing.

I hope this reply answers your question.

Joyce Dassonville GN LLB
Family Law and Health & Disability Law

Address:# 114 – 8532 120th Street
Surrey, British Columbia,
V3W 3N5
Phone: (604) 598-8623
Fax: (604) 598-8624
Email: joyce@dassonvillelaw.ca
Web Page:www.dassonvillelaw.ca

[Deleted User]

I don't really know what Joyce is talking about when she says Monday is the deadline for filing an appeal of the Anderson case — the government filed their appeal of Anderson yesterday. Also, predicting the Court of Appeal will uphold Auton is kind of old news-the Court of Appeal already upheld Auton. We'll see if they will do the same for Anderson et al. And then we'll see if the SCC will finally put an end to all of these endless BC government appeals, once and for all.

[Deleted User]

I am replying to Erik Minty.

My daughter is currently doing a Fluency Based Training ABA Program. Prior to this she had a Lovass based program for almost 3 years. A Fluency Based Training Program is an ABA program. There are some differences between a Lovaas ABA Program and a Fluency Based Training ABA Program, in particular a Fluency Based Training ABA Program times the trials in addition to counting the correct answers. My daughter made tremendous progress in her Lovaas based ABA program and is making even better progress in her current Fluency Based Training ABA Program.

I am not an expert on Fluency Based Training ABA Programs, I am only a Mom of an autistic child who is making great progress. My daughter has come a long way and has a long way to go yet. I do not have the expertise to accurately describe the small differences between a Fluency Based Training ABA Program and a Lovaas ABA program.

My best effort to describe a Fluency Based Training ABA Program is as follows. A properly designed Fluency Based Training ABA Program incorporates efficient, effective practice strategies that enable learners to achieve fluency, or true mastery of skills. When accuracy is combined with speed, it is called fluent performance. People exhibit fluency—the ability to think, speak, and act correctly and quickly, without hesitation and almost automatically. It is this speed and relative ease, not merely accuracy or correctness, that separates the fluent from the non-fluent.

The following guidelines also help describe fluency.

1. Provide sufficient practice opportunities. Fluency only comes with practice. Few training programs in any field (besides music or athletics) provide sufficient practice opportunities to attain fluency. It’s important that a Fluency Based Training ABA Program includes enough examples and exercises on critical skills and functions to practice to the point of fluency.
2. Build fluency in small chunks. Until one is fluent, it’s better to work in brief practice sessions than for extended, tiring periods. Likewise, it’s far easier to build fluency on a small set of commands or functions than to try to become fluent on a larger number at once. Therefore, it’s advisable to design brief repeated practice activities (one to five minutes each) with short breaks in between. Dysfluent skills create weak foundations for further learning.
3. Establish fluency goals. Because fluency is accuracy plus speed, you set time criteria for every skill.
4. Measure performance. Time brief practice activities and count.
5. Define fluency objectively, in terms of time limits plus accuracy levels. You can’t predict how long it will take a given individual to reach fluency. Invariably, some attain fluency faster than others, so individualized practice is best.

When working with a Lovaas based ABA program Dominique would sometimes need “maintenance” sessions as she would forget past learned skills over time. This is no longer a problem with the Fluency Based Training ABA Program. She now learns each individual skill to the point of fluency before building on that skill. The skill is solid and able to be used to build upon.

There are hundreds of reported peer review articles on Fluency Based Training ABA Programs, some available on the Internet. Perhaps you could have a look at a few of them if you are interested. I really cannot explain it any better. I just know how my daughter is doing.

I hope my answer has been of some help.

Joyce Dassonville GN LLB
Family Law and Health & Disability Law
Address:# 114 – 8532 120th Street
Surrey, British Columbia,
V3W 3N5
Phone: (604) 598-8623
Fax: (604) 598-8624
Email: joyce@dassonvillelaw.ca
Web Page:www.dassonvillelaw.ca

[Author]

Posts