[Deleted User]

*** PECS/FLASHCARDS*******

Dose anyone know of any great websites that offer free pecs, or flashcards??? (ie: emotions, actions, food…) Boardmaker is very expensive, and out of my reach at this time. Any suggestions would be great! Thanks

[Deleted User]

Further to the discussion regarding Suzanne Jacobsen:
On learning my son was autistic, I researched and interviewed the big name consultants.
We actually ended up hiring Dr. Jacobsen, who practices Verbal Behaviour/ABA, and have been more than happy with her program.
On researching ABA, I did decide to use Verbal Behaviour, (partly as our child is so young). With a focus on natural environment teaching, we have found skills to transition very nicely from one situation to another, although the skills are still taught through discreet trial.

Not only has Suzanne been excellent, our lead therapist, Anna Matchneva, has been awesome. I follow the program closely, and read information like mad.
Both have taken training under Dr. Vincent Carbone, and I know other consultants implement his techniques (Verbal Behaviour), though they don't call it Verbal Behaviour.
I know this is not Lovaas ABA, but it's working wonders on my son.
Thanks for listening.
p.s. I know this is a Lovaas site, and I really appreciate all the information I derive from it. I also appreciate that other styles of therapy are not to be discussed. I write this not as support for Verbal Behaviour being superior to Lovaas ABA, but merely in support of Dr. Jacobsen.

[Deleted User]

This is in response to Barb,

I posted to your EIBI question. I wanted to assure you it was not YOU who was violating any feat rules, it would be ME if I let my anger get the better of me when answering your questions. Your question is exactly the type of question new parents should be asking.

EIBI and other govt. agencies have caused parents so much strife, that we "seasoned" feat members may let our anger out when responding to your questions. (as you can see by recent posts). If you ever see anger in a post it is not because we are lunatics or fanatics, it is because someone has harmed our children, or has made our life very difficult (in my case financially) or has blocked our efforts to get help for our children.

So please feel free to ask good questions. It is what the board is here for. Learn from what we have to say, and remember that there is a very good reason for any anger that spills out(and that reason has nothing to do with the person who asks the question).

[Deleted User]

In response to Isaac’s post about the Paperman post!

Isaac wrote, “First, regarding whether the erman post (Nov. 16, 4:22
PM) does or does not constitute a violation of forum rules
— it doesn't. The post may be spirited, but it's clearly
well within forum rules insofar as it only speaks of
government-funded agencies and, moreover, is devoid of any
personal attack against a member of this forum.”

I am a little confused about this. The FEAT chat board rules clearly state:

“To be a member in good standing, please respect the following:

1) Be courteous to each other. We ask you to refrain from abusive language, insults and profanity (swearing).

2) Personal attacks are not permissible in the FEAT BC Discussion Group. We respect all opinions even if we disagree with them.”

First, rule one was clearly violated as the statements that included “hacks,” “creeps,” “butchers,” “imposters,” and saying, “There is a special hell waiting,” are clearly insults.

Second, I would disagree that the statements were not a personal attach. Mr. Paperman may not have named anyone specifically, but the statement “all these old government hacks,” “these creeps,” “Avoid like the plague anybody who was ever involved with,” “those EIBI butchers,” “There is a special hell waiting for these imposters,” “they'll all be roasting in it,” “their lies,” are directly aimed at “ANYBODY” who ever worked with any of these organizations, which is a personal attack. Mr. Paperman was directly insulting everyone who works for these organizations, but instead of naming each of the employees individually (which he couldn’t do because he doesn’t know them – making these statements even worse), he grouped them together under the words “these, those, they and their!” Words that are plural representations of many individuals! The Feat Rules do not state that personal attacks are attacks at an individual, as apposed to attacks at a group of individuals clumped together!

For example (and I do not mean anything by the following Paragraph), if I were to replace the government organizations with FEAT in Mr. Paperman’s e-mail, many of you will have been offended. I will end my e-mail with an example, as I will presume the example will make many of you angry and you will not attend to what the message says after the example. I will state though, that becoming angry with what the examples says (although I DON NOT mean what I have written) means that I have insulted YOU, and therefore also means that MR. Paperman’s post was a personal attack, as I have only changed who the post is aimed at, not the content of the post. I apologize in advance, but I feel you need to see the other perspective!

The message may have looked like:

[NOT MR. PAPERMAN’S ORIGINAL POST] IF I MAY JUST CALL A SPADE A SPADE HERE, OUR FRIENDS OVER AT A.S. OF B.C. SEEM TO BE DOING THEIR BEST, BUT I HAVE TO SAY THAT FEAT OF BC IS A TOTAL PIECE OF CRAP. THERE ARE LIKE A HALF DOZEN TO A DOZEN OR SO LEGITIMATE PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT THEIR KIDS, AND THEN THERE ARE ALL THESE OLD FEAT HACKS. IT REALLY BURNS ME TO SEE THESE CREEPS WHO ARE SUDDENLY TRYING TO PRETEND TO BE GOOD PARENTS. MY PERSONAL SUGGESTION FOR ALL NEW PARENTS IS TO TAKE FEAT WITH A GIGANTIC CUBE OF SALT. EMAIL A LONGSTANDING PARENT OR FOUR AND ASK WHAT SUPPORT THEY SHOULD USE, HAVE USED, AND ARE/WERE HAPPY WITH. AVOID LIKE THE PLAGUE ANYBODY WHO WAS EVER INVOLVED WITH THOSE FEAT BUTCHERS. THERE IS A SPECIAL HELL WAITING FOR THESE IMPOSTERS WHO HARM OUT CHILDREN BY KEEPING THEM FROM ACCESSING LEGITIMATE SERVICES. SOONER OR LATER, THEY'LL ALL BE ROASTING IN IT. IN THE MEANTIME, DON'T GET CAUGHT BY THEIR LIES AND IMPERSONATIONS. [NOT MR. PAPERMAN’S ORIGINAL POST]

Again I apologize if I have offended, but I also hope the point is made!

[Deleted User]

***********fighting for funding*****************
Could anyone please fill me in on when the auton case, (if that is what it is called….) is going up infront of the judge. I have been told that there is something going on early next year, but am really unsure of exactly what is taking place. Any explination would be wonderful. I am trying to follow all of the stories, but am feeling overwhelmed by everything, and not being able to fully understand the situation. I look forward to any insight.

[Deleted User]

Intermediate Behavioural Therapist Training:

FEAT of BC is pleased to annouce that they will be sponsoring a one day workshop with a focus on training for those who have the basics but need to hone and develop their skills.

This workshop will build upon content taught in the FEAT of BC basic workshop therefore participants should have attended a basic workshop by either FEAT of BC or by a recognized Lovaas Consultant.

Topics to be covered include:
-reinforcement – how to deliver effective, high–quality reinforcement
-The art of prompting
-set up, management and practice with trial by trial data collection
-Team Management
-The role of the Senior Therapist/Instructor
-how to make your team meetings effective and purposeful
-Organization, a corner stone to a well run program

Those who will benefit from this workshop include:
-present behavioural instructors and Aides or other individuals who have atteneded a basic workshop through FEAT or their Consultant
-Parents
-Sr. Therapists

DATE: January 17, 2004
TIME: 9:00 – 4:00
Place: SFU, room to be announced
COST: $25.00

Registration form will be posted within the next week.

[Deleted User]

To the EIBI question asker,

Sorry about the delay in responding to you. It is difficult to explain how frustrated we are sometimes. I must post anonymously because the government collected a file one inch thick of everything I have said in TV, radio, newspaper and internet in order to intimidate me. It is no wonder we are paranoid sounding. Your post is just asking for someone to "break the feat rules". I'll try to answer calmly.

EIBI? I once again refer back to what everyone keeps saying. Check training, experience and references. It has been 2 years since the government offered the $60,000 per year EIBI program to my child. I asked my social worker for the ABA qualification of the people running the EIBI program. She couldn't tell me. I went to a meeting for EIBI parents and asked the question. The supervisor told me she had NO training in ABA, but that Dr. Kysella would be overseeing the ABA portion of their program (what other portion there could possibly be is beyond me). But Dr. Kysella also could not tell me where he got his training in ABA. He said he was a pioneer like Dr. Lovaas. So I looked up his research and there was none done with autistic children. (feel free to do a search for research by Kysella on the internet)

Things may have changed in the last couple of years, so check for your self. Ask for training and/or education background. Working for a year as a line therapist DOES NOT train someone to be a consultant. DOES NOT train someone to make programing decisions.

If you were to train under EIBI, I would not let you near my child even if it was offered for free (over me having to pay for my childs current program).

If you really want to make a difference in autistic children's lives, go to the Early Autism Project or contact Sabrina to find out what universities offer ABA Masters degrees (with practical ABA experience, supervised by professionals taught by Lovaas or descendent of Lovaas)

EIBI pays more initially, but short term gain will result in long term pain….not just for you but for others.

[Deleted User]

Hello, I am the person who asked the simple question regarding what is the difference bewteen an ABA therapist and an EIBI therapist in terms of training.

I am wanting to, perhaps, make a career change from school support worker to working with children with autism and I would really appreciate it if someone could explain the differences in the two types of therapists. My goal is to one day work as a behavioural consultant and to make the best choices to move towards that goal I need information – I had thought that this would be a wonderful source, to get it from straight from those who have first hand knowledge.

Perhaps someone can suggest where else I might try. Is it not clear cut? Is there separate, distinct training involved for each?

any direction would be appreciated.

[Deleted User]

Quite often the terms "bona fide LOVAAS" and "bona fide LOVAAS consultants" have been mentioned on this list.My son has been in treatment for over 6 years and several of these recommended consultants have provided their services to his program. I know discrete trial teaching is the main component of a LOVAAS program but in the programs designed for my child by these "bona fide" consultants implentation of DTT was sporadic, combined with other methods and data was not taken except anecdotally. What qualifications are required to be considered a "bona fide Lovaas consultant" and what does a "bona fide Lovaas ABA program" look like? I know discrete trial is a big part of it but what about the data collection methods and analysis of this data? If an ABA program involves methods of instructions OTHER than DTT, i.e.Verbal Behavior, Precision Teaching, Social Stories etc.does that prevent that program from being considered "bona fide"? Is ongoing upgrading of skills by a consultant and knowledge of current research considered to be necessary? As a parent who has been involved in the implementation of an intensive home-based program for my child for a long time I feel that this area is not specific and has never, to my knowledge, been defined for the consumers of these services. My question basically is "What is LOVAAS ABA and what qualifications are recommended for a consultant providing "bona fide" programming to a child with autism?"
I ask these questions sincerely and look forward to responses from the list.
DeeDee Doyle
deedeedoyle@hotmail.com

[Deleted User]

Hello Anonymous, latest in the series of people who think it's tasteful to hide behind "anonymous" and criticize from the peanut gallery. Look! I can do it too!

First of all, a personal attack is one that uses NAMES, like for instance if I knew yours and said nasty things about you, even if they were true. THAT would be a personal attack. Saying that government-sponsored imposters are hacks is not a personal attack — it is a restating in common colloquial terms of what the courts have already etched into the laws of the land. I didn't rule that the government's pitiful excuses for autism treatment are imposters, THE COURTS DID. Try reading the judgements.

Second of all, yes, you're right, I am quite convinced you are one of these government employees here trolling the FEAT board to create confusion for new parents and dissension among the rest of us. In fact, you more or less admitted the same, so I don't really need to assume anything, now do I? You say you're on our side? I say no ethical, responsible person with half a brain would work for these government-sponsored hacks. I might ask you, Ms. Anonymous, whether you're witless or immoral, but then THAT would be a personal attack, so I won't do that. Instead, I'll just tell you that one day you will look back on your life and understand that you helped these snake-oil salesmen prey on defenceless children. I don't think you'll be so smug or pleased with yourself then.

There is NOTHING lower in my books, no more despicable slimebag, than those who sit with their snouts in the government trough, sucking up tax dollars while pretending to care about our children, while instead keeping them from getting the help they so vitally need, from QUALIFIED, EXPERIENCED, EXPERT Lovaas ABA consultants and therapists. I would dearly love to name these evildoers, to make a list for anyone to peruse, but THAT, Ms. Anonymous, would be a personal attack. So instead, I will remind all new parents — Caveat emptor. Buyer beware. Check references. Demand names and phone numbers of parents who have used them before. Ask all the questions up front. Never settle for hacks. Always remember that the "treatment" by frauds is worse than no treatment at all. One day these impersonators will rot in jail or in hell for their crimes. I really don't care which.

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